Fostering Human Connection, Communication and Growth

Welcome to the unforgettable conversations podcast, where you'll meet people from all walks of life. Everyone from experts in their fields to ordinary folks leading extraordinary lives. We're pulling back the curtain every week on sometimes difficult, often hilarious, but always engaging conversations that promise to be unforgettable.

My guest today had a rough story, overcoming a challenging childhood and dyslexia instead of discouraging her though it fueled her flames of success and ambition. Today. She is a frequent speaker for top tier organizations, including the NFL, Raymond James major league baseball Moen, Bayer and Hyatt. She is a featured business etiquette expert for bloomberg the new york times usa today mashable monster.com, chicago tribune red book hgtv parade real simple and the wall street journal she is a best-selling author of the everyday etiquette book. How to navigate 101 common and uncommon social situations. She is a TV and radio personality. And for more than a decade, her etiquette segments aired in 165 markets across the us on the syndicated daytime show. She is a wife, a mom, and a very dear friend, her name. Patricia Rossi.

Good afternoon, Patricia Rossi.

So happy to be here.

I am so happy to have you today. You are such an unforgettable person. You have the most endearing Southern accent. You give the wisest, sagest advice and you're just kind all around. So it's really nice to spend some time with you today.

Oh, thank you. Well, you're one of mine and my husband Bobby's best friends. It's just funny how you used to fuss at me and make me go on TV. And we argue, and when this camera would come on, we'd be like, hello, I'm Patricia Rossi. And if people could see how you were roughing me up me up before, which I needed. But we would always laugh and I mean, you would fuss at me all the way up to 5, 4, 3, 2, 1.

That I've learned. Especially too coming out of the pandemic and being around my family, that I tend to be a perfectionist and that's not always the best, I mean, because I'm not by any stretch perfect. But I'm one of those people that, I guess as I tell them, I have a touch of OCD. They're like touch like my God. I just want everybody to be the best they can be. And so I just push and push and push, and that's not really a good way to be, but that's the way I am.

that's how friendships work. I tell you it gifted me. It made me good and made me do something I needed to do that was terrified. Like I remember the first time I went on the radio I remember you're banging on the bathroom door. I'm like, gosh, if people could see us, you know, But you helped me. And that's what etiquette and, relationship building is all about is pushing people to their potential and honey, you did,

I did. And I apologize.

My God, we laugh Bobby and I laugh all the time that you're probably the only person that could have gotten me moving in the right direction.

I could see your dream and your potential. And I just knew that you were going to be great at what you did and what your dream was. And you did not only did you achieve your dream, but I think you've surpassed it. I mean, you have really come into your own and done some amazing things just this little idea about what you wanted to do. You've written a book, you're constantly on TV. You're featured in all the big publications. but it didn't start out that way. You started out as a little kid who had some serious things to overcome. So can you tell me about that? Well, wait, where do you want me to start? Start wherever you like.

First this makes me cry. I want to say, goodness and glory and achievement came out of a bad situation. Good things come out of bad things. Well, when I was 10, I think I found out I had dyslexia and it was, I wanna say 1975 or six. And people didn't know a lot about it then Sandi people didn't know what that was. So I think it caused a form of isolation for me. I thought something was wrong with me socially. now I've learned, everybody thinks there's something wrong with them socially. Like the fanciest people come up and pull my arms. I gotta tell you something. And I say, what? And they say, I feel awkward at a conference or a cocktail party. I'm like, guess what? 90% of us do. So I read over 200 etiquette books in my life. I don't even know if you know that. Do you know that I ever told you that? I was, dropping my dad off to jail one weekend and there in the jail was my favorite school teacher and I was so ashamed and I am like, Oh, my gosh, you know, cause back then things were shameful. Now you wear that going to jail, like a crown,

Your dad, wasn't a guard or an employee of the jail?

No, my dad was in the jail. He was a jail bird for this one little period. So I was dropping him off. He had to go on the weekends and the next week at school, so sweet. She handed me an etiquette book and she said, you might want to read this. Well, you know, if my dyslexia, I couldn't even spell the word. I still can't. How many times did you have to spell that for me in the day. but I, I liked it and I said, you know what, I'm going to, I want to connect with people, and that's what I teach now, fostering human connection, communication and growth. So I read 200 books and went on through my life. I sold pharmaceuticals and then you got a hold of me and you'd like, pull that out of me and made it shine. And here we are on your podcast. Well, I'm so glad you here it and you're here to tell you a story. So, how did your dream start? You dropped your daddy off at the jail and you went home, went to school, the teacher gave you the books, but that's a stretch between that and television, you know, how do you get from a to B. I sold pharmaceuticals and I would always get back to the doctors before the other pharmaceutical reps. And the doctors, the physicians would say, I want you to work with my staff to be kind and endearing with the patients. I want you to teach them how you come in here and how you are with us. So, number one, I had to teach them, how do people see you? I had to teach them to be affective in different environments with different cultures. So you kind of like, you're a 10 man band, you know, you got to figure this out in three seconds. So I would get all my rounds done in the days that I could go teach these medical folks I was so happy, but I didn't want to be the bleach blonde, Southern talking, you know, looking like a, I don't know. I old school, manners marm. I didn't want anybody to know I was doing it. I did it on down low..

How, how do you read somebody? How do you, figure out who you are and help people see you.

So people give you cues and clues to what's important to them right away. So the second part of my business that I teach. Uh, corporations law school, medical school. This is something that I'm going in to teach a lot is the DISC. But I would be in airports and people would see me and say, yeah, what is my letter? I'm a D I'm an E I'm a, they didn't remember their letter. So now I teach it in the form of birds. A gentleman invented it. His name is Merrick and he invented this bird. So if I ask you to describe an Eagle to me, what are three words you would say to describe an Eagle?

I would say Regal, um, integrity. Yes. And. American

and, and they're dominant in direct and brave. And are they flock animals or do you see them by themselves?

By themselves?

By themselves. So if you had to describe a parrot, how would you describe a parrot?

Oh, talkative, friendly, outgoing,

and colorful. And then if you had to describe a dove there's one word, everybody always says, how would you describe a dove?

Oh, geez. Peaceful?

Peaceful and they want stability and security. They bring peace. And then lastly, if you had to describe an owl, how would you describe this owl?

Oh, geez. Wise

yeah. That's it wise. And they're all about facts and data. You've got to be brief. And you got to, you know, say funny things, but you've got to get to know that Owl first, I would never say that out of the gate with him. So you're one of those birds and here's an easy way. So, you know, and our listeners know if you're a doctor and you walk into the waiting room and the person jumps up and says, give it to me straight. I want it right now. Be brief, be brilliant, be gone. That's an Eagle dominant, direct. The doctor walks into the room and the patient sitting there and they say, oh, I went to duke university. My cousin went to duke. Oh my gosh, we're practically best friends. You know, you have the what?,

the parrot.

The parrot okay. Right away. I want these doctors to know, because I want them to know how to treat people. If you walk in the room and somebody's arm is hanging off and bleeding on the floor and they're sitting there real tight pristine with their body language. And they're like, oh, there's nothing wrong with me. I don't want to bother you. I want you to get all your other work done. That's the peaceful dove. And then if you walk in and they have a list of questions and they don't shake your hand, they just want to get to the, then you've got the owl.. So I love teaching this.. So I kinda tell them I have an etiquette one and two, because if you don't know what your bird is, then how are you going to honor the other three birds? And I step out every day with a purpose to honor people. Right away, I can tell who they are because I know who I am. And I know when I have to hold my little red parrot wings in.

Oh, that's really interesting. And that's an easy way to understand that. I mean, simple and easy, so anybody can do it, which is what I love about the stuff that you teach. One of the things that, we all at some point have to go to a big event and you're not the fussy etiquette teacher. You are the one who's basically down and dirty and you teach us like it is. So if we go to a banquet and you taught me. Making the letters B and D with your fingers so that you can put them on your lap and figure out what is all this cutlery, where were the glasses? What's mine. What's his. And so tell me a little bit about your philosophy with etiquette.

Well, I love the tagline you came up for me when you first got me started and it was kindness, not formality relationships, not rules.. I don't know how you came up with that, but I say it in my sleep and that's basically my mantra. I mean, it's everything to me. I tell people walking into an event everybody's nervous. So when I stepped through a doorway, because that's when everybody looks to the door, when you're walking through, you cannot be worried. How am I going to talk to, I don't know anybody here. I tell people to change that to, who can I put at ease? So all you've got to do is find people standing alone or people standing in a group of three and the people standing in a group of three, you can just walk up. They'll let you in, or the person alone approach them. But if two people are talking intently, Try not to interrupt them, but there'll be somebody standing alone. If you have in your heart, I'm going to go in here and I'm going to put them at ease. Then you're not so nervous. And it takes the pressure off of you. Everything nowadays is done online, it's done on zoom. A lot of people aren't back in the office. What are some tips you can give people for zoom meetings? I mean, do you wear pants? What do you do? So we got real relaxed in our zoom meetings, but it's very important. Again, my mantra is honor and respect have a boomerang effect. So do you see any dirty laundry behind me?

I do not.

There you see any cocktails around?

I do not

NO. And do you see messy papers piled up behind me on my desk?

I do not.

And again, no dirty laundry, you know, so our background tells our story. You've had to have an intriguing and fascinating background, and I always tell people don't have your bed in the background. I've seen that so much. And if you do, when there's a, like an emergency. Please make sure it's made, you want to be respectful of your not only yourself, but what other people have to look at.

All right. We're back in the office now. There's a whole issue about eating lunch at your desk, and it's the same as on an airplane. There is nothing worse than eating in those situations, if you bring your own food, talk about that a little bit.

So we just want to, again, this just so simple, the shortcut is respect. You do not want to bring last night's fish or garlic or onions, anything that stinks you don't want to bring. I've seen people airplanes they bring a whole buffet and it smells and you're hearing them chew and you're eating and you know, you're in the fetal position. in your seat because they're splayed out all over. So it's just so simple. Just respect. You're not going to be on that plane for a thousand days. You know, take some snacks, take some little things, but there's going to be food in the airport. I promise or food on the way or food when you get off the plane. Also I tell people the bathroom, isn't a day spa, do all your things you need to do in the bathroom at the airport, because it, it affects backing out from the gate and it affects other people trying to get in. So it is not a day spa and try to do your biggest business in the airport.

Isn't that the truth I'm telling you. As a former frequent traveler, that was really a pet peeve is that, you know, people hogging up the bathroom, but nowadays it's much more difficult to fly because do we wear a mask? Don't we wear a mask, let's have a fist fight over, who's wearing a mask and who's got, you know, a g-string on instead of a mask. So how, how, how do we handle that?

Well, I say we comply with the rules. Rules are put in place for a reason. You know how fast I drive. I don't wanna stop at red lights, but I do. It's important that I follow the rules and we don't want to do a lot of the things we're supposed to, but I do think about elderly people on the plane that are nervous and they're worried about their health and everybody's so nervous on a plane anyway. So I say, you know what, I'm just going to follow the rules. And if I can't, I'm not getting on this plane, I can honor other people for three to four hours. So that's my stance.

And I agree. I think that's a beautiful way to look at it, you know? And that's once again, kindness first. One of the things that I want to talk about is for me, is coming out of this pandemic and I get invitations to go somewhere. And let me tell you I'm coming up with every excuse so I don't have to leave the house. I'm like what happened to me? I used to love to go out. I'm an introvert basically to begin with, but I never had this fear of going and having to, you know, so what do I do now? Do I shake hands? Do I bump elbows? Do I stand six feet back? What is the protocol now that we're just starting to get out and about in the world again? How do we behave?

Well, we're really like a big, huge animal kingdom and you can smell what somebody wants to do. They might put their hand over their heart like this, or do the prayer has like don't come near me or they may stick their hand out to shake hands. And if you're in Miami, you're going to get kissed to death,. So get ready. It's the region you're in. I think it's real important that we make ourselves, even if it's twice a week, get out there and connect because we're social and so many good things come from being social. And it's so much easier to stay home. It's much easier to stay home in our yoga britches, but we really need to connect and we can't grow without people. If it weren't for you, we wouldn't be doing this. I wouldn't have gone on TV or have a book or do speeches. So if I would've just been home hibernating, I wouldn't have grown. You know, that we gotta push ourselves to go out there.

Which brings up another thing, what about like going to the theater because we all love the theater and we're getting to do these things again, we're getting to actually go to the grocery store, and restaurants and kind of socialize a little bit and all these things that we were used to doing, but somehow people have, seem to have lost their minds over the last two years. And forgot, what it's like to be decent. What are some good tricks that we can, especially if somebody, is, stepping into your space. How do you handle things nowadays? Manners in general and being thoughtful of other people in general, like cutting ahead of people in the checkout line or just people have seem to, maybe it's just me. Maybe I've been inside so long. I forgot, but they seem a little ruder.

If people could just think networking really doesn't happen in that two hours that you call a networking event, networking hppens in the theater on airplanes. So we meet people in these places that you think aren't networking events. We had to remember there are behaviors that connect and there are behaviors that disconnect and our connections are what push us forward. I remember there was this speaker that landed in a town and to speak and he put on Twitter. This is an a S-hole. He just said a bad word. This is a, you know what. The people that hired him, that was their beloved city. Do you know, they text him and said, don't even come, don't even come to the hotel. You're talking bad about my city. So it just goes back to the most basic rules. The basic rules are: show honor and respect kindness, not formality relationships, not rules. And I do agree with you. I think we've forgotten that, you know, and people don't know what to do at the table and they get nervous. And, you know, I say from Yale to jail wall street, the street gangs, all we want to respect. That's all we want. So I tell people, so you don't hijack your boss's bread plate. Just remember the car B M W. And that's Bread, Meal, Water.. And then I say, how many letters and fork, and thereby says four. And I say, how many letters in left, four. Where your forks always going to live? And so your forks are always going to be on the left. So when people learn these little rhymes and that's how I learned as a dyslexic student, I made little ways to remember things. I had great memory because I had to do that to survive, which was a gift because it makes you stealthy.

That it does. And you are. I find that you can go into any situation and you put people at ease. How can we put people at ease? I love going somewhere with you because you're always incredible. You always make sure that you introduce me you're very, you're very kind and thoughtful of others. So how can the rest of us who haven't read 200 etiquette books, make sure that we make others feel the way that you make us feel?

Once I pull my spanks, my high come up high and I fixed my little Bunyan's in my shoe. I think how can I honor another human being and the whole night will go, okay. And sometimes I tell the truth, you know, my professional athletes that I teach, they always pull me aside and say, I have this fundraiser thing with these fancy people. I like. I get nervous too, but you know how to face people, toes, tummy, heart, you know, the perfect handshake, you know, to pause, to see if they want to do that. I have shown them the perfect seven body stance leads so that they shine. Plus they've learned what their core bird is and they know what's walking up to them. You can tell from body language, if it's a dove and owl, an Eagle or parrot, I can tell right away. So I said, you're armed with all that. And remember professional athletes are the stars. People are dying to talk to them. So just be, kind, be kind and listen, when they say, oh, I met you in 2005 and you signed this thing and they're just going on and on. And your eyes are glazing over. Just repeat that back. Oh, you met me at so-and-so in Jacksonville, Florida. And so all you've got to do is repeat it back and that person feels honored and they're going to go tell their whole neighborhood about meeting, you and you were phenomenal.

Now, what about you just said body stances. I've never heard that before. What are the body stances that you have to do?

So you can see what I'm doing right now is I'm showing you, what am I doing? You're folding your arms. Okay. Does this make you want to approach me?

No. It makes me feel like you don't want to be bothered.

Right now, look at the difference. Okay. So we say, look for people. If you want to look for other people that are nervous, people that are standing with their arms crossed. And then I say, um, now look at the difference in my body now, what am I doing now? Yes, I'm leaning. And when we lay, we lose 90% of our credibility. And I always tell people, you are your own brand. You stand up straight. And when someone comes up to meet you, you stand up out of your chair. Don't you stay sitting down. I said, anyway, people, if you stay sitting down, they have power over you, you know? They seem as the most dominant. The other thing is, what am I doing right now?

I think you do the fig leaf kind of with your hands clasped in front.

Yes. So a lot of people right away, I can say on the corner of my eye, if someone standing in the fig leaf they're nervous and guarded, so I'll approach that person. So I just teach them to open up all those signals and body language so that people will approach them and they do appear confident. And stable and agile at the same time.

That's really helpful and, I mean, I always knew about that. I just didn't realize how you could apply it when you're in a public situation with other people and who to, who to hang out with at a party.

Well, and you also there's some people may, and you had to run away from too. So there's a way to do that with respect. So I always tell people there's three steps to that, and you say their name. We all love to hear their name and whatever they've been going on and on about. Um, you repeat that? Oh, you just went skiing are you're going skiing. So Sandi, um, have a great time on your ski trip while you're shaking the hand. If you're a handshaker you don't have to be. And then you just say, I've got to go say hello to the host you know, before I go, uh, lovely to meet you or nice to meet you. So you didn't just, you know, point up and say, look, there's George Clooney. And when they look, you know, you run away, you can't do that. So I always say honor people, especially if someone's latched on to you and you can't get away, they're extra nervous. So give them a little extra time. Say their name mentioned something back. They told you and shake hands. So you're getting all those touches in.

Oh, that's awesome. That's great advice. Now, speaking of names, I am the worst at names you can tell me somebody's name and two minutes later, I'm like saying the wrong name or not saying it all. Or if somebody comes up to me and I am with somebody else and I have to introduce them and I can't recall the name. Do you have any tricks for that?

Yes. I have taught a big group of neurosurgeons couple months ago, and I said, if y'all have a problem, remembering names, raise your hand. Every hand went up, well, it's a muscle you have to work. And I said, that is the opening etiquette of putting a patient at ease is say their name. It shows. It's such a small thing, but in a second it shows them, you, they matter, you have you enough to remember their name. And that brings us comfort to hear our name. So that's just funny, but I explained it some muscle when we have to work it. So I always repeat it back. Like you're saying the Sandi McKenna. And when you introduce yourself to someone, you don't just say I'm Patricia Rossi. You say I'm Patricia, Patricia Rossi. I'm Sandi, Sandi McKenna. I always picture someone that looks like someone I know. I met a girl the other night that looks just like my niece, you know, and they had the same name. So I pictured my niece on her shoulders and repeat it back. And if it's a tough name, ask them to spell it.

Oh, that's a good idea.

Yeah.

Hopefully I can remember some names. Although I did do that one time, I equated the name of the person with somebody who looks similar and then when I saw, but they had different names. And so I called the person, I was at a complete conversation with the wrong person. Oh my. Yeah. So I've learned I, that was a painful lesson and the person looked at me like I was nuts, which I was, so, yeah. It's important to remember somebody's name. That really is who they identify as

it's just so simple. And these people are so worried about what to do and how to act, but it's just the simple acts of honoring kindness and investment. That's an investment that puts your energy and they're remembering someone's name, but whoa, it has a long and lasting effect.

Now what about the truth and kindness? Sometimes you have to say something truthful that could come out unkind. Is there a trick to that?

So do you mean like work or friends or neighbors?

I just mean anything in general? Like somebody said, oh, how do you like my outfit? And you hate it, but you don't want to be dishonest, but you want to be kind, is there a way around that?

So if someone can't fix something in 30 seconds, like they can't go home and change that outfit. So you would just have to say, oh, it's interesting. Or, oh, you can find one thing nice to say, I like the color or the cut or the fit, the form. You know, you can say something, but if it's not a hair hitching, a ride, they can take that off, you know, but there's no sense in hurting people's feelings. I mean, really, and truly, so if they can't change it, then I wouldn't say it. Unless it were you when you like, don't wear that on TV and I'd be like, okay, you know, I mean, if it was something that I really needed to know, you know? Yeah. Well,

It's like, you're using me as the, what not to do what not to do what not to say.

Well, there's a difference in somebody you're close to, that's helping you be better, or, so there's a big difference in that. But if someone, you know, is that the party of the year and they're like, do you like my outfit? They w they think that they're like, shining like a new dime. You don't want to say, oh my gosh, you just blinded me, with those big, bold, flapping colors. If they can't change it where they are, I would find something kind to say,

What about online etiquette? Is there such a thing because nowadays when you go online, it seems to be the wild, wild west. And it started out where people kind of polite and people were very conversational and very nice, but now it's kind of, you know, no limits. I mean, there was no limits to what someone can say or pictures they can post. And you're just like, oh my God. How do you handle that?

I think the second mantra people should walk around saying to themselves all day long is the new first impression is online. And I am never going to talk you into my stance of what I believe by blessing you out and saying cuss words. And if you wanted someone to educate you and change your mind, Are they going to do it by blessing you out or saying something horrible to you? Or are they going to sway you to their way or maybe a new way of thinking by being kind and explaining? So I think we have a lot of bravado behind the keyboard, but all of that is searchable. And people can look it up and not always say when I'm again, teaching professional athletes or my medical schools or my corporations, I always stand up two people. And I say, you're looking for, I'm gonna say a doctor. Here's the doctor, here's a doctor. And you Google, you found out you're sick. You go Google. If this person has no social media, it worries you. If this person has a little bit social media, this doctor, and you see what they're doing, their charities, the good things they're doing, you know, I always say. The young don't know how to eat and the mature don't know how to tweet. So everybody, me and you used to always say that it's this a reverse mentorship. The young is, you know, now also mentoring the old, but um, if you're under 30 and you don't have. Uh, social media presence we think you're in the witness protection program and if you're over 30 and you don't have a robust social media, we think you're a tech dinosaur, and you didn't adapt because the new first impressions online. And I do when I google, when somebody is not there, I should say, I'll call you. You'll find them with your detective skills, but, um, you just that new first impression, so you want it to be truthful. What are your charities? What does matter to you? Like when you go on my Instagram or LinkedIn, you know, right away, what matters to me and Hey, you're not going to win the whole world over, but it's better than just a dark space that people can't see in to.

So how do you cultivate a good online presence?

So you're just honest about what you're passionate about and you put things like that on, and then you're as professional as possible. I say no reason to ever say a bad word online. There's nothing that important to me. That's not what I want to spread out there and that's not part of my brand. So if you think of somebody like a Gary V I know he says some cuss words sometimes, but that's just his brand. So you have to think about what your brand is and what matters and what you want to convey. And I want to convey civility.. And I want to convey bringing people together and to be effective in different environments. So I can't go offend in different cultural groups. You know, like my one brother is from Cuba. My other brother in law is from, Iran. So I want to understand both of their cultures to honor both of them. So you've got to work at it and you've got to stretch. If you want to connect and be successful, I do think it's the number one key to be successful.

Now, are there some like hard don'ts like, don't do this, don't do this online.

Oh, my goodness. Well, online don't, don't spam somebody and stalk them the day after there, there is a cadence and a grace to connecting with someone and learn to use it. I would say it's the new language we all need to know it and, you know, The NFL found me on Twitter. Thank you again, Sandi McKenna that you got to say on Twitter, you know, you would tell me, this is what you got to do. And I listened to you. So they found me and accounting firm that I've worked with for years now, they found me on LinkedIn and then sororities I work with, they found me on Insta. So. You know, you've just got to, you got to be splashing around in those social medias and understand them because they are a new language and you want to be agile so that you can connect with the age groups that you want to connect with.

And you don't want to be posting pictures that are gonna to come to haunt you in 20 years.

Right. And it may be cute at the moment, but you really need the think when I walk into my church or my synagogue and do this, or would I walk into the boardroom and do this. You've got to ask yourself, how would my grandparents feel if they saw this? You know, a lot of young people tell me it's on snap and we, they can't find it. And I tell corporations all the time, I look at the audience, I say, oh, I went into a lot of your social media and I'm going to put some of your tweets up on the screen and there's mumbling and nervous laughter. I said, why are you nervous? You know, I kid them and I don't do that to them unless a company calls me in to help somebody fix that. I say, why are you so nervous? You should be proud of your social media. So it's just, I have fun with it, but yeah, if I'm, I don't want to be a tech dinosaur. And I don't want to be in the witness protection program. You've got to be splash. And I may look at the success you had with your road trip, your, your travel, and as a correspondent teaching about travel, you could have never done that without social media.

It was born from social media and it was born from conversations.

Midlife road trip, right? Yeah. So you, that took you to places. I remember. You could have never gotten into, you know, just if you were like locked down in your home, we're going back to the first of our discussion. Get out there Sandi

you're really keen on like thanking people and acknowledging people in all aspects. What suggestions do you have for, you know, really making an impact. If you go on a job interview or you meet somebody that really has impacted you in some way, how, how do you acknowledge that?

So number one, the written word takes time and then you've got to write an address and then you got to pay for a stamp. So you've invested some dead presidents. You know, you put some of your hard earned money into that. And people call me Sandi all the time and they say, oh my goodness, I got a thank you note. And I say, oh my goodness, what did it say? And I hear them. Flip it around. They don't know, but they're so happy. And again, small touches. Why not honor somebody, that's done something good for you. And it does not have to be expensive. It doesn't. So on interviews I tell people you have stamps and an envelope in your car. And after the interview, you write that thank you note the first day, cause nobody else is doing it. And then I say you also send an email thank you note. the way that person corresponded with you. Like today I set up everything by text. The interview I have with the medical school. And then she, and I said everything, and you sent me the zoom on texts today. So you have to adapt to the way people want to communicate. So I'd firstly, thank them how we communicate and then I'd write an old-school thank you note. And it's just three lines, three minutes, and I say send it in within three days, but if you send it in one day, it just packs a bigger punch.

So tell me about your book every day, etiquette, what can people find in your book? How can it change things for them?

It's called everyday etiquette and it's how to navigate 101 common and uncommon social situations, which has every little situation. Every place you're going to find yourself from what to do when you get a tattoo to what to do, if you get invited into somebody's private box at at the Bucs arena or the Lightening or the Yankees, so that things that you're not used to, things that you walk into and they're like, And what do I do here? Well, in someone's box, you don't take the best chair. You wait, then you wait to see where the owners are going to sit first. But just everyday things like your business, dining etiquette, and, you know, three things people always forget are the three P's. When you sit down to a business, dinner, lunch, you pause and you wait until everybody's served. And then. You pace so you don't eat too fast and gobble down your food, and everybody's like only taken four bites or you don't eat so slow that you make other people feel badly. And you know, whether it is continental dining or American dining and you adapt to what your seat mates are doing and you need to be able to do both of those with ease and grace. It's just everyday things everyday situations, we find ourselves in how to be comfortable, you know, how to be comfortable when you're uncomfortable.

That makes perfect sense. Thanks. So where can people find you?

I'm at Patricia rossi.com. Send an email or text I'm highly texts friendly. So Patricia at Patricia rossi.com. And my book is at Barnes and Noble. Amazon it's everywhere you can get a book. And, I just love being on podcasts like this. I'm so excited that I got to do it with somebody I love and admire. I don't know if I didn't meet you I can't imagine what my life would be. I'm just, my heart is so full and I'm so happy.

Isn't Patricia. Incredible to know her is to love her. I am so grateful for the amazing enduring friendship that we have. Her talents no no limits and she has overcome so much to get where she is today. I hope you enjoyed our conversation as much as I did. I'll leave all the links in the show notes where you can find her. If this episode has resonated with you in any way and you know someone who might benefit from hearing it please share it. And if you enjoyed this podcast, please subscribe, review, and rate it. It really helps our rankings. Your feedback is truly appreciated until next time thank you for listening